Comments on: Why Universities Choose NC, and What You Can Do http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325 pragmatism over zeal Fri, 05 Dec 2008 11:29:43 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.6.5 By: Mashup Guide :: Which Creative Commons license to choose? http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325#comment-34546 Mashup Guide :: Which Creative Commons license to choose? Sat, 21 Apr 2007 22:14:00 +0000 http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325#comment-34546 [...] and license under a By-SA license and remove the commercial reuse restrictions? David Wiley's post Why Universities Choose NC, and What You Can Do at iterating toward openness prompted my own comment: I’m very interested in this issue. I’m currently working on a book to [...] [...] and license under a By-SA license and remove the commercial reuse restrictions? David Wiley’s post Why Universities Choose NC, and What You Can Do at iterating toward openness prompted my own comment: I’m very interested in this issue. I’m currently working on a book to [...]

]]> By: Raymond Yee http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325#comment-34543 Raymond Yee Sat, 21 Apr 2007 00:10:21 +0000 http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325#comment-34543 I'm very interested in this issue. I'm currently working on a book to be published by Apress on mashups (http://blog.mashupguide.net/about). The deal I have with my publisher is to publish the book under a By-NC-SA-2.5 license. As David knows, I was debating with myself on what license to choose from among By-NC-SA, By-SA, and the GNU FDL. I finally decided not to go all the way to By-SA because I was afraid that if we didn't go with the NC restriction, a commercial player could undercut Apress (and me) by taking all the materials and selling it in a more commercially advantageous position. That is, I'm afraid of the prospect of someone printing and selling paper copies at cheaper cost or putting up my book on a commercial site and realizing advertising revenue for cheap (since they did not put in the money to produce the book in the first place.) I will admit that my fears may not be well-founded -- so I'm interested in figuring out whether I should revisit the issue of licensing with my publisher. (It's not that Apress is adverse to publishing books under the GFDL -- see http://www.djangobook.com/license/, for instance.) I will say that the incident with Seth Godin's book did not help with my fears though. (http://sethgodin.typepad.com/seths_blog/2007/02/please_dont_buy.html) Bottom line: how do I make my work as open as possible while not opening my publisher and me up to being unfairly taken advantage of commercially? I'm not predicting that I'll be making tons of royalties off my book, but I don't want to have what little might be coming my way to be taken away either! :-) Since I recently left the long-term employ of the University of California, I'm a bit more dependent on income from writing than I used to be. I’m very interested in this issue. I’m currently working on a book to be published by Apress on mashups (http://blog.mashupguide.net/about). The deal I have with my publisher is to publish the book under a By-NC-SA-2.5 license. As David knows, I was debating with myself on what license to choose from among By-NC-SA, By-SA, and the GNU FDL. I finally decided not to go all the way to By-SA because I was afraid that if we didn’t go with the NC restriction, a commercial player could undercut Apress (and me) by taking all the materials and selling it in a more commercially advantageous position. That is, I’m afraid of the prospect of someone printing and selling paper copies at cheaper cost or putting up my book on a commercial site and realizing advertising revenue for cheap (since they did not put in the money to produce the book in the first place.) I will admit that my fears may not be well-founded — so I’m interested in figuring out whether I should revisit the issue of licensing with my publisher. (It’s not that Apress is adverse to publishing books under the GFDL — see http://www.djangobook.com/license/, for instance.)

I will say that the incident with Seth Godin’s book did not help with my fears though. (http://sethgodin.typepad.com/seths_blog/2007/02/please_dont_buy.html)

Bottom line: how do I make my work as open as possible while not opening my publisher and me up to being unfairly taken advantage of commercially? I’m not predicting that I’ll be making tons of royalties off my book, but I don’t want to have what little might be coming my way to be taken away either! :-) Since I recently left the long-term employ of the University of California, I’m a bit more dependent on income from writing than I used to be.

]]> By: Philipp Schmidt http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325#comment-34539 Philipp Schmidt Thu, 19 Apr 2007 07:15:45 +0000 http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325#comment-34539 Stephen: So it was 3rd party discomfort/nervousness :-) You say that NC made them "*much* more supportive" of the project, but did you try to mention the problems associated with NC and explain why NC is neither necessary to achieve what they want, nor does it (in almost all relevant cases) protect their content more effectively than BY-SA? I think they liked NC, because of the same knee-jerk reaction that most people have initially, that somehow NC will protect their property, their business interests, ...] and keep things "nice and fair". From my experience, explaining why that is not the case, usually helps them see through the myths of the NC option. I am not advocating to force anyone to use a particular license, but the licensing subtleties are complicated (after all this community has been arguing about them for months, years?) and we must make an effort to help content owners make a truly informed choice. /P Stephen:

So it was 3rd party discomfort/nervousness :-)

You say that NC made them “*much* more supportive” of the project, but did you try to mention the problems associated with NC and explain why NC is neither necessary to achieve what they want, nor does it (in almost all relevant cases) protect their content more effectively than BY-SA?

I think they liked NC, because of the same knee-jerk reaction that most people have initially, that somehow NC will protect their property, their business interests, …] and keep things “nice and fair”. From my experience, explaining why that is not the case, usually helps them see through the myths of the NC option.

I am not advocating to force anyone to use a particular license, but the licensing subtleties are complicated (after all this community has been arguing about them for months, years?) and we must make an effort to help content owners make a truly informed choice.

/P

]]> By: Stephen Bradley http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325#comment-34537 Stephen Bradley Wed, 18 Apr 2007 18:07:15 +0000 http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325#comment-34537 I'm grateful that us folks that chose an NC CC should not be treated so badly! I just wanted to add though that the key reason we went for NC at UKOU for OpenLearn was not about academic discomfort/nervousness but really because of the sheer amount of 3rd party content that our materials include. We did not want to omit that stuff from our offering as it would have made learning almost impossible for our users and the IP holders (mainly large publishers) were as far as I can see *much* more supportive of the project if they knew the use of their embedded content was restricted to non-commercial. I’m grateful that us folks that chose an NC CC should not be treated so badly! I just wanted to add though that the key reason we went for NC at UKOU for OpenLearn was not about academic discomfort/nervousness but really because of the sheer amount of 3rd party content that our materials include. We did not want to omit that stuff from our offering as it would have made learning almost impossible for our users and the IP holders (mainly large publishers) were as far as I can see *much* more supportive of the project if they knew the use of their embedded content was restricted to non-commercial.

]]> By: Philipp Schmidt http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325#comment-34535 Philipp Schmidt Wed, 18 Apr 2007 13:00:28 +0000 http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325#comment-34535 Hey David - Good title, but then you do not so much explain why some institutions chose NC, but rather argue the "free content" movement should be nice to them. I agree that people get scared when they are supposed to "let go" of their work, and that NC can help ease them into it. However, it is the local champions that argue for the economic merits of the NC license (not as a tool to overcome irrational fear) who must be convinced of the logical errors in their arguments. There are a few cases where the NC option might make sense, but in most cases adding the Share Alike clause to NC achieves the desired outcomes. Who are those evil mis-appropriators that we are scared of? Probably the big media companies and firms. But, these are exactly the organisations that hate Share Alike like the pest (can you imagine the new Madonna video licensed under BY-SA-NC, because they really wanted to include that photograph you took?). So the guys that are worth going after, won't touch your BY-SA content with or without the NC option. That leaves the others, small fish, who might use your content trying to get rich. First, everyone who wants the free content can still get it from you - so that's not really a great business model. Second, these guys are probably not worth going after since they usually don't have assets worth the effort (and legal costs). The only way to keep the content out of their hands would be to keep it locked up. So, if you decide to share, you might as well "share nicely". /P (trying to be nice to everyone) Hey David - Good title, but then you do not so much explain why some institutions chose NC, but rather argue the “free content” movement should be nice to them.

I agree that people get scared when they are supposed to “let go” of their work, and that NC can help ease them into it. However, it is the local champions that argue for the economic merits of the NC license (not as a tool to overcome irrational fear) who must be convinced of the logical errors in their arguments. There are a few cases where the NC option might make sense, but in most cases adding the Share Alike clause to NC achieves the desired outcomes.

Who are those evil mis-appropriators that we are scared of? Probably the big media companies and firms. But, these are exactly the organisations that hate Share Alike like the pest (can you imagine the new Madonna video licensed under BY-SA-NC, because they really wanted to include that photograph you took?). So the guys that are worth going after, won’t touch your BY-SA content with or without the NC option.

That leaves the others, small fish, who might use your content trying to get rich. First, everyone who wants the free content can still get it from you - so that’s not really a great business model. Second, these guys are probably not worth going after since they usually don’t have assets worth the effort (and legal costs). The only way to keep the content out of their hands would be to keep it locked up.

So, if you decide to share, you might as well “share nicely”.

/P (trying to be nice to everyone)

]]> By: Amy Stephen http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325#comment-34522 Amy Stephen Mon, 16 Apr 2007 00:44:35 +0000 http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325#comment-34522 Obviously this is a ridiculous, logical argument to a passionate issue!! *tongue firmly planted in cheek* Yes, please. Let us allow all good people to advance one step at a time. :) Thanks for this read. Obviously this is a ridiculous, logical argument to a passionate issue!! *tongue firmly planted in cheek* Yes, please. Let us allow all good people to advance one step at a time. :) Thanks for this read.

]]> By: Summary of WikiEducator: Memoirs, myths, misrepresentations and the magic | Terra Incognita - A Penn State World Campus Blog http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325#comment-34521 Summary of WikiEducator: Memoirs, myths, misrepresentations and the magic | Terra Incognita - A Penn State World Campus Blog Sun, 15 Apr 2007 04:38:25 +0000 http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325#comment-34521 [...] from Utah State University responded to this thread of discussion with a posting titled “Why Universities Choose NC, and What You Can Do,” which provided an opportunity to reflect on the efforts of pioneering institutions and what [...] [...] from Utah State University responded to this thread of discussion with a posting titled “Why Universities Choose NC, and What You Can Do,” which provided an opportunity to reflect on the efforts of pioneering institutions and what [...]

]]> By: Wayne Mackintosh http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325#comment-34512 Wayne Mackintosh Thu, 12 Apr 2007 06:05:17 +0000 http://opencontent.org/blog/archives/325#comment-34512 Hey David Thanks for popping over at Terra Incognita - I've posted a <a href="http://blog.worldcampus.psu.edu/index.php/2007/04/04/wikieducator/#comment-1751" rel="nofollow">reply</a> Hey David

Thanks for popping over at Terra Incognita - I’ve posted a

reply

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